 |
|
|
|
|
|
| Author |
Message |
phil-news-nospam
Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 12
|
Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:51 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
In alt.tv.tech.hdtv Tom Payne wrote:
| In alt.home-theater.misc John Carrier wrote:
| [...]
|> Most home theaters aren't calibrated and most consumers aren't videophiles.
|> I suspect that either HD or B/R will be superior to anything off air. The
|> market itself will determine the best value, neither politics nor marketing.
|
| Hmmmmm. What makes you think that the "market itself" isn't
| determined by "politics or marketing."
Too often "the free market" is in fact manipulated by such politics or
marketing efforts by corporations. Marketing is certainly an unavoidable
element of it. But marketing should be limited to the competing side
stating their cases (in a glitzy way, I guess). Things like corporate
backroom deals to promote exclusivity and lock-in should be totally
prohibited. An aanlogy case exists with certain cellphone makers that
make their cellphones to only work on certain providers (but do not mix
this up with cellphones that are paid for through a service plan, though
that should only be an option, not the only way to get one).
| Some of my friends believe that as the porn industry goes, so goes the
| market, and they've gone HD-DVD. But so far it's not clear that's how
| the industry is going.
|
| I believe that the battle will be won on something that absurd, but ...
Maybe it will. OTOH, if Microsoft or Toshiba paid off the porn industry
people to make that decision, then that would be wrong.
Decisions by corporations to go with one, or the other (or both, or neither),
should be made indepently, and most certainly not through payoffs.
--
|---------------------------------------/----------------------------------|
| Phil Howard KA9WGN (ka9wgn.ham.org) / Do not send to the address below |
| first name lower case at ipal.net / spamtrap-2007-08-30-0643@ipal.net |
|------------------------------------/-------------------------------------|
Archived from group: alt>home-theater |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Rich Z
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 12
|
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
Tom Payne wrote:
> In alt.home-theater.misc John Carrier wrote:
> [...]
>> Most home theaters aren't calibrated and most consumers aren't videophiles.
>> I suspect that either HD or B/R will be superior to anything off air. The
>> market itself will determine the best value, neither politics nor marketing.
>
> Hmmmmm. What makes you think that the "market itself" isn't
> determined by "politics or marketing."
>
> Some of my friends believe that as the porn industry goes, so goes the
> market, and they've gone HD-DVD. But so far it's not clear that's how
> the industry is going.
>
> I believe that the battle will be won on something that absurd, but ...
>
> THP
I was talking with my local home theater dealer over the weekend. His
opinion is that the format war will not end, that there will be
co-existence. His rationale is this, by the end of the year he expects
we will see the start of an influx of Chinese made, true dual format
players priced comparably with BluRay players ($500 range). The cost
adder for the HD-DVD drive is small, and if you had a choice of a BluRay
player or a combo player for essentially the same money, the consumer
will go combo so as not to get stung. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
inkyblacks
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 1
|
Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:33 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
Stand alone HD DVD players are outselling stand alone Blu-ray
players. Blu-ray is only selling as a game machine. Those who buy HD
DVD players buy more HD discs than stand alone Blu-ray owners buy Blu-
ray discs.
HD DVD player price will drop to $199.99 next month. The $250. HD DVD
machine Toshiba will soon sell comes with a bunch of free HD DVD
movies. HD DVD should win the race if history repeats itself. HD DVD
is more reliable and the discs will last longer, with fewer defects.
Sony was arrogant, as usual, in sticking with Blu-ray, as it is
needlessly expensive and complex, and produces less performance at a
higher cost with lower reliability. The top management at Sony is
nuts and should be fired.
IB |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Jason Burgon
Joined: 04 Aug 2007 Posts: 3
|
Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:16 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
"Rich Z" wrote in message$0$18961$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
> The cost adder for the HD-DVD drive is small, and if you had a choice of a
> BluRay player or a combo player for essentially the same money, the
consumer
> will go combo so as not to get stung.
I did a similar thing with my DVD/SACD/DVD-Audio player; went for the
Panasonic that plays both SACD and DVD-A. Now I don't care which of the two
audio formats wins.
--
Jay
Jason Burgon - author of Graphic Vision
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gvision |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
John Carrier
Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 33
|
Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:02 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
wrote in message @57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
> Stand alone HD DVD players are outselling stand alone Blu-ray
> players. Blu-ray is only selling as a game machine. Those who buy HD
> DVD players buy more HD discs than stand alone Blu-ray owners buy Blu-
> ray discs.
>
> HD DVD player price will drop to $199.99 next month. The $250. HD DVD
> machine Toshiba will soon sell comes with a bunch of free HD DVD
> movies. HD DVD should win the race if history repeats itself. HD DVD
> is more reliable and the discs will last longer, with fewer defects.
That's the 800 pound gorilla in the argument, player cost.
> Sony was arrogant, as usual, in sticking with Blu-ray, as it is
> needlessly expensive and complex, and produces less performance at a
> higher cost with lower reliability. The top management at Sony is
> nuts and should be fired.
While its doubtlessly more expensive ($500 versus $300 at my last check), is
it more complex? Does it have less performance (it's got greater capacity)?
Is there data showing its less reliable?
Sony only made two mistakes with Beta back when. Too expensive and not
enough playing time. It was superior in every way to VHS, but lost on what
mattered most to the consumer. Likely that will happen again, but I doubt
it'll have anything to do with complexity, performance or reliability.
R / John |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
rdclark
Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 6
|
Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:59 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
> I did a similar thing with my DVD/SACD/DVD-Audio player; went for the
> Panasonic that plays both SACD and DVD-A. Now I don't care which of the two
> audio formats wins.
What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
r |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Mutley
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 1
|
Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:41 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
"inkyblacks@yahoo.com" wrote:
>Stand alone HD DVD players are outselling stand alone Blu-ray
>players. Blu-ray is only selling as a game machine. Those who buy HD
>DVD players buy more HD discs than stand alone Blu-ray owners buy Blu-
>ray discs.
>
>HD DVD player price will drop to $199.99 next month. The $250. HD DVD
>machine Toshiba will soon sell comes with a bunch of free HD DVD
>movies. HD DVD should win the race if history repeats itself. HD DVD
>is more reliable and the discs will last longer, with fewer defects.
>
>Sony was arrogant, as usual, in sticking with Blu-ray, as it is
>needlessly expensive and complex, and produces less performance at a
>higher cost with lower reliability. The top management at Sony is
>nuts and should be fired.
>
>IB
I think Sony is getting desperate.
"Sony invites Toshiba and Microsoft to join Blu-ray camp"
http://www.pocket-lint.co.uk/news/news.phtml/9946/10970/sony-invites-toshiba-blu-ray-group.phtml |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Rich Z
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 12
|
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 12:33 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
rdclark wrote:
> On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
>
>> I did a similar thing with my DVD/SACD/DVD-Audio player; went for the
>> Panasonic that plays both SACD and DVD-A. Now I don't care which of the two
>> audio formats wins.
>
> What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
>
> r
>
>
Several years ago I bought a Denon DVD player which has DVD-A
capability. I do have a few DVD-A discs, am amazed with their quality,
distraught that there are almost no new releases worth buying, and
concerned that ultimately when I upgrade to High Definition DVD, the
player wont support the format. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Lloyd Parsons
Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 6
|
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:43 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
In article ,
"Jason Burgon" wrote:
> "rdclark" wrote in message
> @k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> > On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
> >
> >> Now I don't care which of the two audio formats wins.
> >
> > What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
>
> Yes, the number of releases on either format has been very disappointing.
> Pink Floyd's "Dark Side of the Moon" on SACD shows just what incredible
> results can be acheived.
>
> I think the bottom line is that Joe Public doesn't care much about sound
> quality, and is quite happy with his MP3 download playing on his £20
> speakers.
>
> --
> Jay
>
> Jason Burgon - author of Graphic Vision
> http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gvision
I think that really does hit the nail on the head and is part of the
problem that Hi Def DVD is having in gaining marketshare.
First all too many average homes have TVs smaller than 50", but even at
50" if they are watching from 10' or more away, they can't see enough
difference between Hi Def DVDs and upscaled standard DVDs.
Then with the HTIB or small surround, or maybe just the TV sound, they
don't get enough benefit from the better soundtracks of the newer
HDDVD/BD encodes.
That's why total marketshare of both hi defs combined is only 1-2%. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Jason Burgon
Joined: 04 Aug 2007 Posts: 3
|
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 6:34 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
"rdclark" wrote in message@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
>
>> Now I don't care which of the two audio formats wins.
>
> What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
Yes, the number of releases on either format has been very disappointing.
Pink Floyd's "Dark Side of the Moon" on SACD shows just what incredible
results can be acheived.
I think the bottom line is that Joe Public doesn't care much about sound
quality, and is quite happy with his MP3 download playing on his £20
speakers.
--
Jay
Jason Burgon - author of Graphic Vision
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gvision |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Doug McDonald
Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 2
|
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 7:35 pm Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
rdclark wrote:
> On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
>
>> I did a similar thing with my DVD/SACD/DVD-Audio player; went for the
>> Panasonic that plays both SACD and DVD-A. Now I don't care which of the two
>> audio formats wins.
>
> What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
>
> r
>
>
SACD seems still quite alive; out of 16 disks I just bought,
three are SACD. Most but not all of the others were recorded
in plain stereo ... there is no surround or center channel to
cause a need for SACD. The recordings I have on SACD span the
time period of initial recording from 1955 to 2005. The 1955-1967
ones of course are not surround, but rather three channel
stereo with a separate center channel, and play as such on the
SACD player.
Doug McDonald |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Rich Clark
Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 16
|
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 4:48 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
"Doug McDonald" wrote in message $bpq$1@news.ks.uiuc.edu...
> SACD seems still quite alive; out of 16 disks I just bought,
> three are SACD. Most but not all of the others were recorded
> in plain stereo ... there is no surround or center channel to
> cause a need for SACD. The recordings I have on SACD span the
> time period of initial recording from 1955 to 2005. The 1955-1967
> ones of course are not surround, but rather three channel
> stereo with a separate center channel, and play as such on the
> SACD player.
You can buy anything in any format ever made if you're willing to pay
enough. That's the meaning of "niche" in the phrase "niche format." So yes,
SACD is "alive" in the sense that a brain-dead person who needs a machine to
keep breathing is "alive."
Sony, the inventor and chief proponent of SACD, has abandoned it. How much
more dead can it get?
r |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
common_ sense
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 4
|
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 7:58 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
Doug McDonald wrote:
>rdclark wrote:
>> On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
>>
>>> I did a similar thing with my DVD/SACD/DVD-Audio player; went for the
>>> Panasonic that plays both SACD and DVD-A. Now I don't care which of the two
>>> audio formats wins.
>>
>> What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
>>
>> r
>>
>>
>
>SACD seems still quite alive; out of 16 disks I just bought,
>three are SACD. Most but not all of the others were recorded
>in plain stereo ... there is no surround or center channel to
>cause a need for SACD. The recordings I have on SACD span the
>time period of initial recording from 1955 to 2005. The 1955-1967
>ones of course are not surround, but rather three channel
>stereo with a separate center channel, and play as such on the
>SACD player.
>
>Doug McDonald
your numbers not only say the format is dead, its been embalmed and
buried. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
common_ sense
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 4
|
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 7:59 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
"Jason Burgon" wrote:
>"rdclark" wrote in message
>@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>> On Sep 5, 10:16 pm, "Jason Burgon" wrote:
>>
>>> Now I don't care which of the two audio formats wins.
>>
>> What we didn't anticipate was that they would both lose!
>
>Yes, the number of releases on either format has been very disappointing.
>Pink Floyd's "Dark Side of the Moon" on SACD shows just what incredible
>results can be acheived.
>
>I think the bottom line is that Joe Public doesn't care much about sound
>quality, and is quite happy with his MP3 download playing on his £20
>speakers.
>
>--
>Jay
>
>Jason Burgon - author of Graphic Vision
>http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gvision
>
>
sad to say
You are absolutely correct. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
common_ sense
Joined: 27 Sep 2007 Posts: 4
|
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:07 am Post subject: Re: Blu-ray discs sales figures are higher then HD DVD discs |
|
|
"Rich Clark" wrote:
>
>"Doug McDonald" wrote in message
>$bpq$1@news.ks.uiuc.edu...
>
>> SACD seems still quite alive; out of 16 disks I just bought,
>> three are SACD. Most but not all of the others were recorded
>> in plain stereo ... there is no surround or center channel to
>> cause a need for SACD. The recordings I have on SACD span the
>> time period of initial recording from 1955 to 2005. The 1955-1967
>> ones of course are not surround, but rather three channel
>> stereo with a separate center channel, and play as such on the
>> SACD player.
>
>You can buy anything in any format ever made if you're willing to pay
>enough. That's the meaning of "niche" in the phrase "niche format." So yes,
>SACD is "alive" in the sense that a brain-dead person who needs a machine to
>keep breathing is "alive."
>
>Sony, the inventor and chief proponent of SACD, has abandoned it. How much
>more dead can it get?
>
>r
>
>
Its dead, buried, and not mourned over,,,,properly mastered 48khz CDs
are indeed "perfect sound forever". Note I said properly mastered.
Another over priced Sony techno triumph,,LOL
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|